light weight pully questions???

Bertoxb2 · 02-04-2008, 12:46 AM

dont know if this has been asked, i searched but didn't find what i was looking for. So here go's, for the xb 2 or any car will a light weight pully hurt the motor in any way.... example: added stress? and do ya'll think it will void warranty

thanks for the help!!!!

PCH · 02-04-2008, 12:55 AM

It will void the warranty. Read the following and make your choise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_balancer

Daarken · 02-04-2008, 12:58 AM

Quote:

This article does not cite any references or sources. (January 2008)
Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources. Unverifiable material may be challenged and removed.

When in doubt, call the dealership.

PCH · 02-04-2008, 01:13 AM

Lets put it this way: if your engine throws a rod or develops bearing noise and you get it to the dealer with the aftermarket lightened crankshaft pulley, then they will not cover repair under warranty and rightfully so.
If you drive normally without being abusive to the engine and maxing it out and just looking for a little more pep, then you will most likely not experience any negative effects of removing the factory harmonic balancer for a very long time.

Bertoxb2 · 02-04-2008, 01:23 AM

thanks guys.... lots of help

Bertoxb2 · 02-05-2008, 05:24 PM

ok, well lets say something were to happen with the car due to having a light weight pulley, how would the dealership know that you had a light weight pulley installed (thus voiding the warranty), if you were to swap it back to the stock one?..... is there an ecu record log in the cars ecu... sorry if this is a noob a** question.. thanks

Maddman · 02-05-2008, 06:55 PM

all i can say is the world is round.
if u can sleep at night its all good then

whitebreadbox · 02-06-2008, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCH

It will void the warranty. Read the following and make your choise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_balancer

ITS NOT A DAMPER OF ANY SORT!!!! its only a pulley!!!! and if it causes a problem with the engine, due to shelling out, improper installation... it will void the warranty. all the light weight pulleys do is remove excess weight from the rotating parts on the outside of the engine. the crank pulley only drives accessories... ie, water pump, alternator, A/C compressor... it does not act as a harmonic balancer, damper or any other vibration reducer. before listening to anyone, do your homework. know if it has a built in damper (which this one DOESN'T) or not. talk to people who have these mods, because we did our homework.

TrevorS · 03-02-2008, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitebreadbox

ITS NOT A DAMPER OF ANY SORT!!!! its only a pulley!!!! and if it causes a problem with the engine, due to shelling out, improper installation... it will void the warranty. all the light weight pulleys do is remove excess weight from the rotating parts on the outside of the engine. the crank pulley only drives accessories... ie, water pump, alternator, A/C compressor... it does not act as a harmonic balancer, damper or any other vibration reducer. before listening to anyone, do your homework. know if it has a built in damper (which this one DOESN'T) or not. talk to people who have these mods, because we did our homework.

Unfortunately, it IS in fact a torsional harmonic vibration damper. I've been trying to investigate this through a thread at ScionLife and I just found a photo today in this forum's own DIY section that clearly proves it. Here it is:

I placed an order for an Agency Power crank pulley a week ago based on the assertion the oem pulley was just a factory cost saving heavy steel pulley -- however, it's now apparent to me that's not the case.

Here is my thread at ScionLife. A lot of information is accessable through it:
http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=213108

My aluminum pulley arrives Tuesday -- now I have to decide if I'm actually going to install it.

Daarken · 03-02-2008, 04:50 PM

from reading that thread, the guy who posted the pic still wants to do it.

TrevorS · 03-02-2008, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daarken

from reading that thread, the guy who posted the pic still wants to do it.

If you're referring to me, then as I said in the post above yours -- that's a decision I still have to make. I would like to know more about the specific frequencies the damper is designed to control, but fundamentally, I'm really not necessarily excited about removing devices designed to protect the engine.

ToyotaTech · 03-02-2008, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCH

It will void the warranty. Read the following and make your choise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_balancer

The link posted is absolutly correct on harmonic balancer operation. also the pic is of a 1nz and not a 2az but they are both harmonic balancer's and look the same.

a harmonic balancer DOES decrease vibration in the engines rotating assy. im not one to say how much or how long your veh will run befor u would run into engine problems but it will definatly cause engine issues sometime and most likely when ur out of warrenty range.

Yes it will basicly void the whole rotating assy warrenty, now as far as just swithching the pulley out yea u can but their are some ways for a good tech to be able to tell but even at that u really coldnt void it unless u know without a dought that a light weight pully caused the failure but thiis would be hard to do because of the broad range of things that can cause these types of failures.

TrevorS · 03-03-2008, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToyotaTech

The link posted is absolutly correct on harmonic balancer operation. also the pic is of a 1nz and not a 2az but they are both harmonic balancer's and look the same.

I gather you are actually a Toyota engine technician with specific knowledge of the xB engines? Am I correct in interpreting you as saying the above photo is actually of a 1.5L xB engine? (I think that's what you're saying.) But you are also saying the crank "pulley"s for BOTH the 1.5L and 2.4L engines are actually dampers and look similar.

I'm having a really difficult time justifying the installation of the light-weight pulley I just paid $141 for. I'm thinking perhaps eBay is a better destination for it than my xB.

**NoLimitzInd** · 03-03-2008, 11:56 PM

I had one on my tC for well over a year and am going on the one on my xB2 for almost 6 months now. Not a issue at all.

ToyotaTech · 03-08-2008, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrevorS

I gather you are actually a Toyota engine technician with specific knowledge of the xB engines? Am I correct in interpreting you as saying the above photo is actually of a 1.5L xB engine? (I think that's what you're saying.) But you are also saying the crank "pulley"s for BOTH the 1.5L and 2.4L engines are actually dampers and look similar.

I'm having a really difficult time justifying the installation of the light-weight pulley I just paid $141 for. I'm thinking perhaps eBay is a better destination for it than my xB.

yes the pic is of a 1.5 1nz-fe in the gen 1 xb and yaris etc not the 2az-fe 2.4from the xb2,camry, rav4 etc. yes they do the same job they are both harmonic balancers (dampers) even though they have a different design the 1nz is a pin centered balacer and the 2az is a keyway.

personally i would never put a non harmonic balancer on my veh or any veh that was designed to have one, u may never have a failure from it but if u do it will be a expensive one.

toasted_v2 · 03-12-2008, 11:16 PM

The 2AZ-Fe is internally balanced and has balance shafts. The rubber in the stock pulley is minimal and according to my friend (an engineer with Toyota) is only to dampen external vibrations and absorb some of the 'lash' between the engine and accessory drive. Due to his position, he won't comment on using an aftermarket pulley... but 'otr' he thinks they won't cause any problems.

My brother has had a lightweight pulley on his '05 tC (Greddy turbocharged) for about 80k miles, no issues but noticeable difference when he put it on (prior to turbo). I will be ordering the NST crank and water pump pulleys for my v2 box shortly.

TrevorS · 03-13-2008, 12:10 AM

Thanks for your input, but please don't confuse crank balancing with crank dampening -- they are completely different issues. Balance shafts have nothing to do with whether or not the "pulley" provides an important dampening function for crank tortional transients.

toasted_v2 · 03-13-2008, 09:19 AM

The 'balance' shafts are indeed there to dampen harmonics... they rotate at harmonic multiples of the crankshaft - they do not provide any 'balancing' per se.

If there is anyone who has had documented issues, backed up by real analytical (e.g. FMEA) data, that using a lightweight pulley on a 2AZ-FE has in any way compromised reliability or led to an engine issue, please provide your input. Any denied warranty claims?

There is certainly much anecdotal evidence, on multiple forums (especially tC forums where members have used such pulleys for extended periods), that use of a well-designed pulley such as those from NST etc. improves performance without leading to engine issues.

TrevorS · 03-13-2008, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toasted_v2

The 'balance' shafts are indeed there to dampen harmonics... they rotate at harmonic multiples of the crankshaft - they do not provide any 'balancing' per se.

You overlooked the word "tortional", and THAT is the crucial difference between the purposes of the two different mechanisms!

SPIKEnTR · 07-08-2009, 11:43 PM

My aluminum pulley arrives Tuesday -- now I have to decide if I'm actually going to install it.[/quote]

you could send that new pulley MY way!

1/2 priced, of course. In return I'll tell you the cost of my engine repairs, should they happen!